SPOILERS ON THE WAY SO LOOK OUT
* Now this is podracing!
* Alright, so what did we have in this episode. We had cameos from Michael and, extensively, from Libby. These are the kinds of cameos that I personally really love on this show–not Arzt or whoever, not even various Others types, but the characters who really mattered back in Seasons One and Two, before (I think) the game plan for the remainder of the series was fully firmed up. It’s important to me to feel like those characters and their plights matter as much in the world of the show as they mattered to me as a viewer, you know?
* And even beyond that, I was always awfully fond of Michael, whose downfall was one of the first signs we got, along perhaps with Locke’s devolution from Jungle Wolverine to neurotic button-pusher, that the show was willing to really sully its heroes, however temporarily.
* I also liked Libby. We’ve still got a few more feet of Libby mystery to dig through, of course–we have no idea why she was in the mental hospital in the “real” universe, or whether it was really just coincidence that she bumped into Desmond and gave him a boat. I always assumed she was one of Widmore’s agents, like Abbadon or perhaps Mrs. Hawking. But this gave us some cross-dimensional closure on her and Hurley’s truncated love affair, which was one of the show’s least convincing and therefore somehow most convincing romances. And Cynthia Watros, who should wear sundresses as often as possible, gave a bedraggled, barely-keeping-it-together performance that was touchingly optimistic despite it all. I really wanted things to work out for her here, you know? I’m glad they did, more or less.
* So what else did we have? We had Ilana blowing the fuck up! Hahahaha! I can’t believe they went to the “old dynamite from the Black Rock blowing someone the fuck up unexpectedly” well once again, and that it worked as well as it did. My jaw dropped like a cartoon character’s. Again, I assume we’ll get a little more detail on Ilana at some point, but Ben’s assessment seemed accurate: The Island was done with her. I still wonder if “the Island” is a separate entity, in terms of exerting influence on what happens, from Jacob and the Man in Black, but I take his point. Anyway, good, I wasn’t much of an Ilana fan, and I think giving her this kind of ending gives her more oomph than she otherwise had.
* We had a full-fledged, no messing around, seriously guys on the Internet we’re making this as clear as we possibly can ANSWER! The whispers are dead people stuck on the Island. So it turns out is really is purgatory, for some people at least. Let me know when Lostpedia is finished going through all the whispers’ appearances and figures out who was probably whispering in each one and why. This explanation works fine for me, if you were wondering, though I imagine “ghosts” will be unacceptable to the LOST IS SERIOUS BIZNESS crowd.
* We had Fake Locke tossing Desmond down a well! Hahahahaha! Poor guy. Somehow I think things will work out for him anyway. I know this wasn’t the same well Locke went down couple seasons ago, but given all the tunnels and passageways under the Island, I wonder if Desmond can turn the donkey wheel without being teleported?
* We had Ultimate Richard/Ben/Miles team-up! Can’t wait for the walking-through-the-jungle banter that combo will serve up.
* Crap, I feel like I’m missing some more stuff I was really excited about! Dammit.
* No bad guy in Hurley’s flashsideways, did you notice? Unless you count Chang/Candle/Halliwax.
* Jack’s resignation of the presidency went down a little more smoothly than I’d worried it would with me. I don’t wanna see him turn into the happy wanderer, that’s my concern about a Jack who can let go, but I’m glad they’re directly addressing that failure has consequences, and his change of behavior makes sense.
* The owner of a fried chicken fast-food chain sponsoring the humane society? Yeah, right.
* Desmond’s a GQMF in addition to being a timecop. It was fun watching him traipse around the flashsideways, all blithely bringing people to consciousness and shit–but it was even more fun watching that get flipped on its head when he ran over a man in a wheelchair. He’s being positively Jacobian in his serene weirdness in both worlds.
* Haha, I take a contrarian’s pleasure in watching Desmond a) get tossed down a well, and b) run over a cripple.
* Dr. Linus on perv patrol. Love it.
* I found the swagger of Fake Locke and the silence of Dark Sayid good and sinister in this episode. I particularly like how Sayid’s now all but an extension of Fake Locke, answering only to him, even speaking only to him.
* Basically, what I want to communicate is that a lot happened in this episode! It was all over the place, fast and furious, and at nearly every pre-commercial cliffhanger, since I was watching it via TiVo and fastforwarding through the commercials, I worried that was the end of the show, since they’d packed so much in. They even added an “extra” flashsideways segment, if you will. Last week I expressed skepticism that the Desmond episode meant we’d arrived at the “okay, it’s on now” segment of the season, but I stand corrected, apparently! Edge of your seat stuff.
>>>I know this wasn’t the same well Locke went down couple seasons ago, but given all the tunnels and passageways under the Island, I wonder if Desmond can turn the donkey wheel without being teleported?
It wasn’t? I know the well was filled in *at one point* but do we know when that was in reletion to the now?
Maybe it was just my headcold but I was unimpressed by the whole fanservicey return of Libby. And then at the end we had the return of Hot Desmond, Sideways World Bleed and everything got super awesome real fast.
-I can’t believe I saw people on blogs and message boards last week expecting this to be another filler episode. what a great hour of Lost that was.
-I think we’ve been seeing Jack’s resignation of leadership for the past few episodes (since the lighthouse), and his little heart to heart with Hurley and especially the way he and MIB stared each other down at the end implied it was time for him to take back the reigns again.
-I’m wondering if sideways Desmond ran over wheelchair Locke b/c of Fake Locke throwing Island Desmond down the well.
-(what a bizarre fucking sentence that was to write.)
-wondering why Island boy showed up again. Every time he’s shown up, MIB has been alone in the jungle with someone in a potentially threatening situation. Richard couldn’t see him, but Desmond and Sawyer could. Weird.
-I’m hoping for(and sure we’ll get it)a little more explanation on what’s going on with Sayid and Claire, and hopefully some kind of small redemption for them. I can’t help feeling really sorry for Sayid, seeing him turned into a complete psycho. Dude didn’t care at all that Desmond, one of his buddies, had just been “killed”, and no matter what wrongs the pre-infection Sayid had done, he wouldn’t have reacted like that.
-I wouldn’t be surprised if that’s the total explanation for Libby. They could just say she checked herself into the asylum because of her husband’s death. The whole coincidental thing with Desmond and Hurely pre-Island is just the same random connection thing that’s happening to everyone else.
-and what a great way to turn the sideways Desmond plot on its head. It’s not all happy reunion “It’s A Wonderful Life” stuff there, happily. And that it happened so soon was another nice little surprise.
-hoping we’ll see sideways Michael sometime. and Ana Lucia.
-so I wonder what makes a dead person unable to move on past the Island. And if they can actually appear to people only on the Island, or off Island also? Because are the dead people Hurley spoke to in L.A. also unable to move on?
-and so is the real Locke unable to move on? Or maybe that’s what MIB needed for his plans, to take possession of a ghost unable to move on?
An observation for what it’s worth: all the people in the sideways universe who have served as direct catalysts for “awakening” characters (Charlie, Faraday, Libby) are people who are dead in the real universe. This could mean nothing and Desmond could throw it all on its head, but it stood out to me.
Real world wondering: You think Harold Perinneau was pissed again that he only got to come on and say a few quick lines? I remember how vocal he was about his first comeback not being meaningful enough.
More later.
…I enjoy your Lost thoughts very much and agree with you on everything…I do have one question that I’m hoping you won’t find too foolish: what does GQMF stand for? my fist thought was GQ(as in the magazine)MoFo…if that’s the case, I totally agree hahahaha man, Des is hot!…
More later, but first two quick comments:
1) Heidi, I thought the original well was near some other building. I could be misremembering, however.
2) Ana Maria–yep, that’s what GQMF means! 🙂
This was a super fun episode.
I was kinda bummed though because I predicted Ilana getting blown up and Desmond getting thrown down that well, but Locke getting ran over surprised the shit out of me! I hope Desmond only did it to make him remember; I’m tired of bad things happening to Locke. Though I do love balls-crazy, time meddling Desmond. I get the sense that he doesn’t give a shit about what’s happening in our reality cause he knows what he’s up to in the other one.
I also get the feeling that the people who have died in our reality are able to get the flashes in the new reality, since Libby, Charlie and Daniel have. It makes me want to re-watch the episodes with Locke and Boone and Charlotte and see if there are any little winks.
And I do greatly enjoy the Locke/Sayid dynamic. They’re like a comic super villian duo!
I’m excited for more to come.
Kudos for seeing the Ilana kaboom coming, Sam, because that one blindsided me for sure. In retrospect, I can see the pretty clear foreshadowing, but I wasn’t ready for it (and loved it).
And yeah, like I said above, I’m with you on there being some sort of significance to being dead in the main timeline giving you awareness in the sideways-verse. I wonder if the scene Faraday referred to between him and Charlotte that we didn’t get to see had her getting a flash just like he did. I also wonder if Boone’s conversation with Locke on the plane had more significance than we originally realized.
Sean, why is it Cynthia Watros can nail this character so well and yet fell flat on her face as young(er) CeCe on Gossip Girl? Acting or writing, what say you?
Strangely enough, I’m ok if that’s all we get on the Libby-Hurley insane asylum stuff. Now that we’ve established Libby is a person who will voluntarily sign herself into a mental hospital in the sideways verse, I’m willing to buy she did the same in the real world out of grief over her husband’s death and Hurley just happened to be there. Would I like to learn her husband was somebody of significance, that there was more than coincidence at work (like possible Widmore shenanigans) and if she recognized Hurley on the island? Sure, but I don’t NEED to.
Interesting that Lapidus was the one guy Smokey didn’t anticipate arriving who nonetheless stuck with Hurley’s crew rather than went off with Richard. I hope this doesn’t make him cannon fodder, though I do fear.
It’s definitely on now. I think the casualties will be ramping up big in coming weeks. If I were Dark Tina Fey, Miles, Lapidus or even Widmore or Richard, I’d watch my back (this would also presuppose my being a fictional character). I don’t think any of the main characters will bite it pre-finale because I still think even Sayid and Claire are headed for big showdowns with perhaps Jack or Sawyer and Kate respectively (sadly I think Sayid will ultimately end simply being the Goro to Smokey’s Shang Tsung, which is unfortunate since he’s an OG, but perhaps there will be more to it).
Well, I liked this episode, though I’m not sure how much i have to say about it.
–I think I’m about ready to give up on my theory of parallel tracks for the others who appear in lostie flashes. Maybe sometimes a Candle is just a Candle, so to speak. (And a little easter eggy treat, I suppose.)
–Ilana’s character arc was a lot like Dogen’s, wasn’t it? A mysterious servant of Jacob claims to have special knowledge about the situation, refuses to share or explain the source of that knowledge, orders the Losties around, and then dies suddenly, never having revealed much of anything other than the fact that Jacob’s minions do a lot of things that they justify as being “for your own good.” This is where I’m pinning my hopes for something other than a strict Manichean good vs. evil showdown.
–Desmond and Locke was a great moment, wasn’t it? Both in the original and flash timeline, those two just aren’t going to get along. But flash-Des is starting to complicate the equation for ends/means justifications, isn’t he?
–Maybe just a random connection, but Jack’s recognition of the need to “let go” makes me wonder whether the flashverse Losties will need to “let go” of their improved sideways lives, or of the dreams and recognitions that remind them of the other life (a la the Astro City story raised in last week’s thread.)
–Finally, an unspoiled and unspoiling thought on the next episode teasers: they sure are picking weird musical cues for these clips, aren’t they? Leonard Cohen; Amazing Grace; the tunnel song from Willy Wonka? I sometimes think the music supervisor is just messing with us.
re: Why the “Hello, Jack” from Fake Locke seemed to rattle Jack so much at the end, Smokey HAS lost his shape-shifting abilities and couldn’t be appearing as, say, Christian to Jack and Locke as everybody else, could he?
We’ve still got a few more feet of Libby mystery to dig through, of course–we have no idea why she was in the mental hospital in the “real” universe.
Because she had mental problems. Really, that’s it. I don’t understand why people demand to know about this. In a world with giant cyborg bears – I mean, smoke monsters – who cares?
Is it possible that Desmond running Locke over at the end (which was AWESOME) was just his way of triggering his memory, just as setting Hurley up with Libby was the way of triggering his?
I kind of thought this, then saw it articulated on another thread: is it possible the reason Libby was in the mental hospital originally is that she was having visions of either the Sideways universe or her time on the island. It would explain her thing with Hurley (they’re meant to be together, which we’re certainly seeing a lot of), and also possibly her giving Desmond the boat, if she understand that certain things have to happen in order for the timeline to resolve itself correctly. Did she forget it before the crash? Did she know she was going to be shot? No idea.
Tricky as time travel and alternate realities can be to untangle I have no real desire to try, but I do remain pretty set in the belief that anything that occurred prior to the creation of the Sideways Universe in our viewer chronology (i.e. Libby giving Desmond the boat) was not influenced by the Sideways Universe. That’s my story and I’m sticking to it. No retcons!
–I have a soft spot for a lot of things on Lost, but none moreso than Hurley and Libby. So I was way way into this episode on that aspect alone, even without all the other awesome stuff, which Sean thoroughly covered (Miles, Ben and Richard traipsing through the jungle is indeed going to be a delight).
–I don’t watch the previews, so this is pure speculation on my part, but it really seems like we’re going to get the parallel “Jack tries to fix Locke” stories now, right? I thought that wasn’t going to happen, once sideways-Locke decided not to call him for a consult, but now it looks like it’s on. Whether it was sideways-Desmond’s intention or not, I think Locke is going to end up under the care of Dr. Jack Shephard, just as Island Jack tries to reckon with Smokey. (That look he gave Jack when the two camps met sure seemed to signal a swift end to Jack’s brief stint as laidback get-along guy. And as much as they’ve been trying to push Hurley as the new Jacob, Jack vs. Locke for all the marbles has been in the works since the very beginning.)
–The ghost of Leslie Arzt continues to haunt this season (poor Ilana). I hope he’s out there whispering in the jungle somewhere, annoying Michael to no end.
Okay then:
Heidi:
* Awe, I don’t think Libby’s return was fanservicey. It wasn’t “Look at me, I’m an unexpected cameo!”, it was hashing out the emotional relationship between her and Hurley.
Charles R.:
* Jungle Boy! THAT’S what I forgot to mention. Always happy to see Jungle Boy.
* You and Ben and various other people I’ve talked to have me half-convinced that that’s all we’re getting for Libby explanation wise, and half-satisfied with it. More on that anon.
* Right on on the Flashsideways Desmond throwing us a nasty curveball by Grand Theft Auto’ing poor Locke.
* As far as dead people being unable to leave the Island, Michael said it’s because of what he’d done, so I assume the same is true of the rest of ’em.
* Hmm, MIB possessing Locke’s ghost? Hadn’t thought of that before. Wonder how it squares with the disappearing bodies of Christian and Yemi? After all, Locke’s body didn’t disappear.
Ben:
* Faraday only triggered an “awakening” in Desmond in the same sense that Desmond triggered one in Hurley–he just pointed him in the right direction–whereas Charlie and Libby actually caused awakenings in Desmond and Hurley respectively. So I don’t think it lines up quite so neatly in terms of dead characters serving as catalysts. But it’s something to chew on.
Sam:
I suppose I had a hunch Desmond was headed down the well, but Ilana blowing up? No way did I see that coming. Kudos to you, ma’am.
Ben again:
* That flashback episode/backdoor pilot from Gossip Girl stunk the joint up, man. Blame that, not Cynthia.
* I too am worried about Lapidus. I want there to be a damn good reason why he’s been around so long and been so much fun!
Simon:
* It seems to me you’ve theorized your theories like a Candle in the wind.
* Yes, I think the fates of Dogen and Ilana (and Lennon and god knows how many other people) are a cautionary tale. About whom, who the hell knows.
* That the show was willing to be so on the nose and predictable about the source of the whispers–which, again, I’m totally fine with–makes me think it more likely that they really are setting up an Astro City/Last Temptation of Christ/“For the Man Who Has Everything” choice for the castaways.
* Wait, Willy Wonka? You’re the second person I’ve seen mention that–VanDerWerff did too–but I totally missed it! When did that happen?
Ben part trois:
* I was wondering about that big portentous “Hello, Jack” (which seemed to have been dubbed in in post) too. I wonder if it’s just another weird not-quite-cliffhanger a la “We’re takin’ the sub.”
Mitch:
* No need to be so testy! The reason I expected more from the Libby storyline is because the show clearly wanted us to, from the sinister music when she was revealed to be a patient at the asylum to her being the person who just so happened to give Desmond his fateful boat. If there’s no more to it than “She couldn’t handle the grief from her husband’s death and so she checked herself in voluntarily, in much the same way that she checked herself into the asylum in the Flashsideways world voluntarily,” I’ll be okay with that, no problem. (Even though she seemed to be handling her grief just fine when she gave Desmond the boat, and even though someone who checks themselves into a mental hospital voluntarily probably isn’t so far gone that they’d run into one of their fellow patients years later, fall in love with him on a desert island after a plane crash, but apparently have no memories of ever having met him before.) But given the cues that the show itself established, I don’t think it’s unreasonable or foolish or picayune of me to think there might be more to it, and believe me, I’m on a constant warpath about unreasonable, foolish, picayune things people think about this show.
Justin:
* I absolutely assume running Locke over was intended to play some sort of role in bridging him to the “real” world. BUT in what way? I wish I could remember where I said this, but someone asked whether perhaps this was Sideways Desmond’s way of waking up the residual parts of Locke within the Smoke Monster in the real world. I like that theory a lot.
* I think she maybe got a glimpse of her other life in the real world, sure, that’s possible.
Ben:
* The Sideways Universe has already been shown to have differences from the real world that predate not just the crash in 2004 but even the detonation of the bomb in the ’70s, so I would imagine that if things cut both ways, Libby’s donation of the boat to Desmond or her being in the hospital with Hurley is fair game for having been caused, in some way, by the flashsideways unvierse. Wow, that’s dense.
Gardner:
* GETTING LOCKE TO JACK! Ahhh, brilliant explanation of Desmond’s demolition derby, thank you.
How many points for a guy in a wheelchair, by the way?
Yeah, I’ve come to agree/accept that there’s no way it’s a simple one-to-one “dead in real world = catalyst in sideways” thing, but there is *something* to this line of thinking…I just don’t know what.
The Willy Wonka music was in next week’s promo–and for no plot-related reason, I should add, so no spoiler worries–hence why you didn’t catch it given your no promo policy.
In the parlance of our times, “NO PROMO”
So we’re saying that sideways Locke needs to see sideways Jack again to “wake up” because that’s his true love, right? That will explain those Adam & Adam skeletons.
Excellent episode. Defeated Ben Linus is almost as much fun to watch as panicky Richard. I can’t wait to see how it all falls apart for them. I liked Hurley’s D&D moment of digging through Iliana’s gear for valuables and magic trinkets. too.
Desmond plowing down Happy Locke was by far the WTF of the season – that came completely outta nowhere.
Granted, the reveal at the end of that long-ago episode where we see Libby was obviously leading up to something… but I don’t understand why people asked “why was Libby in the hospital” rather than “why han’t she told Hurley?” That, to me, was far more suggestive that she was a Widmore agent or whatever, not the simple fact that she was there at all. But whatever, I guess it’s all done and dusted now.
Sean, I know you don’t watch the promos cause they’re annoying and misleading, but after this next episode airs, you should go back and watch the promo for it. It’s a little slice of awesome. Which I must say, is a rare occurrence.
Hurley finding the bag of holding! That was another little thing that seemed significant but was unexplained, as of yet. What do you suppose was in there? White Rocks, signifying that he’s now the new Jacob?
Now that this episode has aired, I can confirm that last week’s promo showed Michael and showed Hurley at Libby’s grave which as good as gave away that Libby would be here, which is why I’m never watching the promos again. Sean was right, you guys!
The bag contains Jacob’s ashes, which will be of some way to kill or immobilize smokey, I assume.
Or they make a tasty dessert topping, which would also explain Hurley’s interest.
“of some way”??
Sorry, when I wrote that, I had not yet injected my morning coffee.
BTW, is anybody making “THE ISLAND IS A CORK” t shirts yet? I never got my “MAGNETO WAS RIGHT” shirt either.
I figured that Jack was freaked out by Fake Locke’s salutation because the last time he saw Locke, he was lying in a coffin. It’s so easy to forget that from Jack’s point of view, it’s only been a couple of weeks since he saw Locke lying there dead. He was going to swan dive off the bridge a couple of days ago…
He hasn’t seen Locke since then, has he? (It’s so easy to get confused about this stuff. It took me ages to remember how Jin ended up on Whitmore’s side.)
http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/First_meetings#The_Man_in_Black says we just saw the first time Jack and Hurley ever met what’s-his-name.
“I absolutely assume running Locke over was intended to play some sort of role in bridging him to the ‘real’ world. BUT in what way? I wish I could remember where I said this, but someone asked whether perhaps this was Sideways Desmond’s way of waking up the residual parts of Locke within the Smoke Monster in the real world. I like that theory a lot.”
I saw it less about Locke and more about Desmond trying to alter Smoke Monster’s fate somehow. I have no idea what that means, though.