SPOILER WARNING
* Fucking Ben.
* If I looked up and saw Locke and Lt. Daniels staring at me from across the street, I would not walk, I would RUN in the opposite direction. Those are two scary bald motherfuckers.
* It was wonderful to have an episode devoted almost entirely to putting Terry O’Quinn in front of various other actors and having him act toward them. Man is he good. The suicide scene was marvelously tough to endure.
* I thought it was fun how at first you think Ethnic Guy and Ethnic Lady are some kind of agents, but then it turns out they’re just the Jack and Kate of the new group of castaways. (Maybe.) Clever little turnarounds like that are one of the things Lost does so well–and are also a hallmark of season openers for the show, which makes sense because last week’s episode felt like a finale (and may have been intended to be one when it was first mapped out back before the strike shortened last season).
* I was hoping for a bwahaha evil smile on Locke’s face when he discovered injured Ben at his mercy on the Island. Oh well. “‘He’s the man who killed me’ – cut to black” is pretty awesome too.
* One thing Lost tests is one’s ability to read fiction, for want of a better way to put it. That is, when it advances several conflicting theories for what’s actually going on with a character, it will eventually depict that character in a way that confirms one of those theories without coming right out and saying it, but at the same time the show’s byzantine plots and secrets will make people ignore these obvious context clues in the performance, mise en scene, score, even dialogue, and hunt for what’s “really” going on. For example, for a long long time the question among some fans of my acquaintance was “Is Ben telling the truth when he says ‘We’re the good guys’?” It always seemed obvious to me that he and his cronies could only be “good guys” in the most relative sense of the term, since they were constantly busy with the shooting and the torturing and the kidnapping and the brainwashing and the noggins and the piggins and the frikins, but when you finally got to the episode that revealed Ben to be an actual mass murderer, complete with mass graves and everything, I thought it was beyond debate. Amazingly, even after the events of tonight’s episode, in which Ben cold-bloodedly murders the fan-favorite character at his most physically and emotionally helpless, some of these fans are still saying he’s probably the good guy. It reminds me a bit of when it became perfectly clear that Aaron was one of the Oceanic Six and yet people were still holding out for some other sixth member because he was still inside Claire when the ship crashed, as though the media would ignore the baby when coming up with a numerical nickname for the miraculous survivors of a plane crash and stint on a deserted island. It strikes me that part of being able to make heads or tails out of a story like Lost is being able to look at hoofprints and think “horse” rather than “zebra.”
I’ll be honest: I got kinda bored during this ep (and a little the last one). I appreciate a good info dump as much as the next guy and there was nothing wrong with the acting, but two straight weeks of “How we got from point A to point B” when we kinda already knew is enough for me, especially with the lingering action stuff I want them to get back to.
Re: Ben & Widmore
Ben, it boggles my mind that you didn’t like this episode because I found it to be super awesome.
A. I love me some Lt. Daniels, even back before I knew who the hell he was. I could watch him and Locke drive around and eat cheeseburgers and just talk about random shit all day long. The Island better damn well bring him back to life too, cause I’m almost done with the The Wire, and I’m really going to miss him now.
B. I love the fact that Locke is a zombie! With Christian Shepard, it’s been hinted at that he was either brought back to life, or he’s some sort of spirit/figment thingamabobber, but we saw Locke die (which that whole scene was completely awesome and heart-breaking all at the same time) and now he’s on the Island, totally alive, no questions about it.
I’m super psyched for what is next.
I don’t know why it would boggle your mind given that I generally don’t like the episodes you love and vice versa :-p
But hey, I’m more than happy folks other than me enjoyed it!
Another tidbit of errant speculation:
Widmore (as Hanso) funds the Initiative, the Initiative builds the Hatch, the Button keeps the Island from shifting location every 108 minutes.
Widmore’s status is more like that of an exiled king– it’s not that he can’t return, it’s that Ben was appointed by Richard to remove Chuck’s nasty ass. Then the Others purged the Initiative? But no-one could find the Hatch… Why else would it be so well-hidden?
I think that all sort of fits in the timeline.
This episode was so good it made me want to cry.
John Locke is my favorite character ever.
A few things:
I think it is clear that Ben, although extremely smart and devious, has little to no standing of importance with the Island in comparison to John Locke. This is shown repeatedly throughout the series.
1) Ben, as the leader of the others, gets a terminal tumor on his spine. (Locke’s paralysis is cured upon landing on the Island and consequently he comes back to life on the Island so to speak).
2) Richard seeks out Locke to inform him that he will be the leader of the others behind Ben’s back.
3) Ben, due to his concerns about Locke’s status on the Island, shoots him, leaves him to die and John still gets the upper hand on Ben.
4) Christian Shepard tells John not to listen to Ben.
There are many other examples…
This episode definitely makes it seem like Widmore is a “good” guy. Obviously we can’t know yet.
Ben has exteminated a whole compound, left Locke for dead (twice), murdered his own father, murdered Matthew Abaddon, etc. Lied to and tormented pretty much every main character on the show. What have we ever seen Widmore do? He did snap the neck of one of his own when he was on the Island. He was rude to say the least to Desmond when Desmond wanted to propose to Penny. However, Widmore may just be on the “good” side.
Currently, Jack, Kate, Jin and Hurley (that we know) are on the Island in the 1970s (functioning Dharma Initiative van). Locke, Ben, Frank and a woman (Sun?) are in the present on the Island. Ben doesn’t even get taken back in the flash with Jack, Kate and Hurley? He’s just an injured passenger in the crash.
I can’t wait to see what John has in store for Ben. However, we all know that John is not the reactive, killer type.
I guess the Walt is Matthew Abbadon theory goes down the drain. Though they weren’t seen talking to each other and Abaddon gave John “privacy,” when talking to Walt. So can it be ruled out completely?
We still don’t know the “dirty laundry,” between Sayid and Ben. Obviously, when Locke meets Sayid, he has stopped killing for Ben. How did Sayid figure out he was being “manipulated”? And if Ben no longer had use for Sayid, I am guessing he would have had him killed but he lets him work for a charity organization in the Dominican? So did Ben know he needed Sayid alive or is Widmore protecting the Oceanic six?
Who sent the goons after Sayid when he was in LA trying to save Hurley from Ben? Ben?
So many questions. Great episode. I could probably post about this show all day.
My brother, ladies and gentlemen!
I think it is clear that Ben, although extremely smart and devious, has little to no standing of importance with the Island in comparison to John Locke. This is shown repeatedly throughout the series.
Right. I’m assuming that he was so pissed off that Locke had found out about Mrs. Hawking that that’s why he killed him–same as why he shot him when he discovered Locke could see and hear Jacob.
This episode definitely makes it seem like Widmore is a “good” guy. Obviously we can’t know yet.
Ben has exteminated a whole compound, left Locke for dead (twice), murdered his own father, murdered Matthew Abaddon, etc. Lied to and tormented pretty much every main character on the show. What have we ever seen Widmore do? He did snap the neck of one of his own when he was on the Island. He was rude to say the least to Desmond when Desmond wanted to propose to Penny. However, Widmore may just be on the “good” side.
I thought the episode made Widmore look genuinely, convincingly on the good side of the Ben/Widmore battle, too. But then again, you can be judged by the company you keep, and he did hire Keamy and the other thugs to kill everyone on the Island. Maybe he’s telling the truth and he really did just want to get rid of Ben and his followers and clear a path for Locke, but a) overkill, and b) Keamy seems like the kind of person a reasonable man wouldn’t hire–he shot a teenage girl in cold blood to get to her dad, for example, and c) Locke was on the Island at the time, so he’d have ended up just as dead as Ben and everyone else.
I think that what we have here is a classic villain-on-villain fight: Cobra Commander vs. Destro, Dr. Doom vs. the Red Skull, King Kong vs. Godzilla, Alien vs. Predator, Stalin vs. Hitler. Whoever wins, we lose.
Currently, Jack, Kate, Jin and Hurley (that we know) are on the Island in the 1970s (functioning Dharma Initiative van). Locke, Ben, Frank and a woman (Sun?) are in the present on the Island. Ben doesn’t even get taken back in the flash with Jack, Kate and Hurley? He’s just an injured passenger in the crash.
It wasn’t until you spelled it out in this fashion that I realized that you’re right, the two groups are in two different time zones. The abandoned Hydra station that the new characters were hanging out in is proof of that.
I can’t wait to see what John has in store for Ben. However, we all know that John is not the reactive, killer type.
I really, really hope he’s done trusting him.
I guess the Walt is Matthew Abbadon theory goes down the drain. Though they weren’t seen talking to each other and Abaddon gave John “privacy,” when talking to Walt. So can it be ruled out completely?
I’m inclined to think that giving Abbadon such a punk death means it’s unlikely he’s Walt, since that just seems a real downer of a way to take down Walt–not to mention that Walt’s some kind of psychic and could hopefully see his death coming. On the other hand, I thought that giving Abbadon the line “the boy’s gotten bigger” was a subtle nod toward the idea that when Walt grows up, he’s Abbadon.
We still don’t know the “dirty laundry,” between Sayid and Ben. Obviously, when Locke meets Sayid, he has stopped killing for Ben. How did Sayid figure out he was being “manipulated”? And if Ben no longer had use for Sayid, I am guessing he would have had him killed but he lets him work for a charity organization in the Dominican? So did Ben know he needed Sayid alive or is Widmore protecting the Oceanic six?
Good questions.
Who sent the goons after Sayid when he was in LA trying to save Hurley from Ben? Ben?
I’m gonna lean toward the notion that Ben’s behind everything that went wrong with the O6’s lives off the Island until I hear otherwise.
Carnival of souls
* This is so commonsensical I don’t know why I haven’t seen anyone else put it exactly like this, but here’s Tom Spurgeon on those pesky Bookscan numbers and the innumeracy of attempts to use them against the bookstore market:Just…
So –
When Reagan’s people “appropriated” Springsteen’s “Born in the USA” for the campaign, there were all these music critics who were like “Silly Reagan – he obviously hasn’t listened to the lyrics!” Greil Marcus responded by saying (paraphrased) “Silly music critics: Reagan (or his people) are smart because they recognize that in form ‘Born in the USA’ is a triumphant rock anthem, despite the fact that its content (lyrics) are nothing of the sort. And no one is actually going to listen to the lyrics when they’re pumping their fists in the air at his rallies.”
I think there’s something similar going on with the response to Ben*: despite all the awful, evil shit that Ben has done, in form he makes a more attractive leader than almost anyone else on the show. Locke, post-Boone’s death, has been pretty flakey, and Jack, Sawyer, and Kate are all messed up with their own unresolved intimacy issues: they’re all lurching around, flawed – not exactly inspiring.
But Ben Linus, well – he knows what he has to do and he’s going to get it done! He doesn’t waver: he may look nerdy, but he’s not a whiny little boy-man. And… he has a plan! That’s… charismatic… appealing… comforting, even.
And what a brilliant thing for the creators of the show to do! Don’t buy that Ben could lead the Others for so long or fool supposedly smart people like Jack and Juliet: well – he’s fooling the audience – right now !
Anyway, my wife hates Ben and I always get a kick out of pretending to her that I think he’s obviously the show’s real hero because he’s the only one who’s willing to do whatever is necessary to keep the island safe. But there’s a not entirely unconscious part of me that isn’t joking: the part that responds to a leader who’s willing to get things done (regardless, alas, of what those things actually are).
*Although, in this case I think it’s a matter of the creators being tricky/clever and not – in the Springsteen case – of an artist’s populist impulses subverting his message (see also The Sopranos).
And unlike the other characters in leadership positions (Locke, Jack), Ben has never been shown to struggle with his failures. He’s always on to the next scheme, which makes him seem more confident and competent even though he’s really made a mess of things time and time again. Good point, Jon.
Lost thoughts: Season Five episode guide
Below are links to all my “Lost thoughts” posts for this season. I’ll add a link to any post-finale posts when they go up. Episode 5.1: Because You Left/Episode 5.2: The Lie Episode 5.3: Jughead Episode 5.4: The Little Prince…